cablinginstall.com<\/a> for firewall information.<\/p>","upvoteCount":4,"datePublished":"2015-01-28T17:01:24.000Z","url":"https://community.spiceworks.com/t/bulk-cable-run/374855/12","author":{"@type":"Person","name":"chadmockensturm4537","url":"https://community.spiceworks.com/u/chadmockensturm4537"}},"suggestedAnswer":[{"@type":"Answer","text":"I have an upcoming project that I want to bounce off fellow SpiceHeads on how you would approach it.<\/p>\n
Project: Relocate servers to another room in the building.<\/p>\n
Specific Question: How best to run 32 CAT6 wires from point A (our “Network Room”–location of switches and incoming internet connections) to point B (our new “Server Room”).<\/p>\n
-There are 6 firewalls to pass the cabling through.<\/p>\n
-Run length is 200 feet<\/p>\n
-One-story, currently operating medical facility<\/p>\n
-Drop ceiling tiles with 3’ headroom above until you reach the “top”<\/p>\n
-No wiring in place that runs the route, no ladder racks or cable supports in place for the route<\/p>\n
Pull wires 1-by-1 vs. Bundle them on floor, then hoist up into ceiling as a spine<\/p>","upvoteCount":6,"datePublished":"2015-01-28T15:00:03.000Z","url":"https://community.spiceworks.com/t/bulk-cable-run/374855/1","author":{"@type":"Person","name":"samclark2","url":"https://community.spiceworks.com/u/samclark2"}},{"@type":"Answer","text":"
Have a cable company come do it for you. In addition to them having multiple spools of cable that they can pull simultaneously, they will make sure all codes are followed with respect to hanging and putting in appropriate fire stops where they penetrate the firewalls. It’s really not worth the hassle of doing this yourself.<\/p>","upvoteCount":11,"datePublished":"2015-01-28T15:04:38.000Z","url":"https://community.spiceworks.com/t/bulk-cable-run/374855/2","author":{"@type":"Person","name":"PatrickFarrell","url":"https://community.spiceworks.com/u/PatrickFarrell"}},{"@type":"Answer","text":"
Hire cable pullers. I do small runs around here, but only above the drop ceiling, and far less than 200ft. In the walls gets subbed out to a pro.<\/p>","upvoteCount":3,"datePublished":"2015-01-28T15:04:42.000Z","url":"https://community.spiceworks.com/t/bulk-cable-run/374855/3","author":{"@type":"Person","name":"rojoloco","url":"https://community.spiceworks.com/u/rojoloco"}},{"@type":"Answer","text":"
Just put a switch(s) in the “Server room” and trunk it back to the “network room” main switch(s) with less cables.<\/p>","upvoteCount":5,"datePublished":"2015-01-28T15:13:49.000Z","url":"https://community.spiceworks.com/t/bulk-cable-run/374855/4","author":{"@type":"Person","name":"purduepete007","url":"https://community.spiceworks.com/u/purduepete007"}},{"@type":"Answer","text":"
Definitely run them together as a fascist. Make a few runs with that large of a number though. Maybe 4 runs of 8 cables. The increase in numbers will give them added durability for the pull without damaging the twisted pairs. Do yourself a favor and label them before bundling them.<\/p>","upvoteCount":0,"datePublished":"2015-01-28T15:14:17.000Z","url":"https://community.spiceworks.com/t/bulk-cable-run/374855/5","author":{"@type":"Person","name":"timothymccall1055","url":"https://community.spiceworks.com/u/timothymccall1055"}},{"@type":"Answer","text":"
Anyway to reduce the number of servers using virtualization?<\/p>\n
In our environment a lot of our server traffic is actually between servers not to end users so having a switch in the server room isn’t a bad idea, maybe look at running a 2-4 cable trunk or pulling preterminated fiber?<\/p>","upvoteCount":0,"datePublished":"2015-01-28T15:25:17.000Z","url":"https://community.spiceworks.com/t/bulk-cable-run/374855/6","author":{"@type":"Person","name":"weston3340","url":"https://community.spiceworks.com/u/weston3340"}},{"@type":"Answer","text":"
+1 for switch(es) in the server room. \nGet a cabling company in to run a set of fibres between the rooms and use those as the links (add some spare capacity too)<\/p>","upvoteCount":1,"datePublished":"2015-01-28T15:33:16.000Z","url":"https://community.spiceworks.com/t/bulk-cable-run/374855/7","author":{"@type":"Person","name":"tomcarabine","url":"https://community.spiceworks.com/u/tomcarabine"}},{"@type":"Answer","text":"
+1 again for putting a 48 port switch in the existing server room, and running a fiber to the new location. I would probably use Ubiquiti’s edge switches with a 10Gig SFP.<\/p>","upvoteCount":0,"datePublished":"2015-01-28T15:57:03.000Z","url":"https://community.spiceworks.com/t/bulk-cable-run/374855/8","author":{"@type":"Person","name":"marcspehalski7927","url":"https://community.spiceworks.com/u/marcspehalski7927"}},{"@type":"Answer","text":"
I went through this, in a hospital no less. We ran two separate fiber runs on two separate routes, and placed a couple of switches (stacked ciscos) in the new server room. Less cabling, fewer points of failure, greater redundancy<\/p>","upvoteCount":2,"datePublished":"2015-01-28T16:04:17.000Z","url":"https://community.spiceworks.com/t/bulk-cable-run/374855/9","author":{"@type":"Person","name":"noaccount","url":"https://community.spiceworks.com/u/noaccount"}},{"@type":"Answer","text":"
As other have suggested, I would absolutely contract this out.<\/strong> I do 1 - 10 short ethernet runs and never over 30 ft and definitely never through walls unless it’s just drywall. I also never term to RJ-45, it’s just begging for problems. I terminate to a keystone module and put it in a wallplate or “biscuit” (surface box).<\/p>\nHowever, IF you do decide to do this yourself, no question, pull all the cable on the floor to length, cut each one AND NUMBER THEM on the ends with a labeler or sharpie, then bundle them with zip ties. Running them one by one would be a nightmare and tons of extra headache for no reason. You need to number each cable if one fails after you terminate the ends and test them, you can find which one to troubleshoot. Also, I hope you’re going into a patch panel because you absolutely should be.<\/p>","upvoteCount":1,"datePublished":"2015-01-28T16:23:49.000Z","url":"https://community.spiceworks.com/t/bulk-cable-run/374855/10","author":{"@type":"Person","name":"crimsonkida","url":"https://community.spiceworks.com/u/crimsonkida"}},{"@type":"Answer","text":"
Thank you all for the diverse suggestions and answers. Special thanks goes out to the fiber suggestions (investigating this seriously now) and specifically to CrimsonKidA as he/she directly answered my initial question.<\/p>\n
This will be the second time I have handled a server relocation for the company, so I am not new to the process. I contract-out the testing/certification process, but otherwise do everything else in-house. We are a SMB company and that is how things are. My first relocation was performed by running all wires on the ground, labeling them, bundling them, then hoisting the mass into place. I wanted to see if there were any other suggestions as this upcoming relocation extends the run length by an additional 75 feet.<\/p>","upvoteCount":0,"datePublished":"2015-01-28T16:56:13.000Z","url":"https://community.spiceworks.com/t/bulk-cable-run/374855/11","author":{"@type":"Person","name":"samclark2","url":"https://community.spiceworks.com/u/samclark2"}},{"@type":"Answer","text":"
You might want to be concerned with fire codes, you did mention that. Any time you go though firewall you have to seal it off properly. This might be reason enough to hire a pro. If there was ever a fire and an investigator found that the fire went though an improper fire stop.<\/p>\n
Do you own or lease the building? If you lease then you must make sure everything is done to code, or it could come back on you. Even if you own the building you still have to support the cables in the plenum some how. J hook or other wise.<\/p>","upvoteCount":0,"datePublished":"2015-01-28T17:08:59.000Z","url":"https://community.spiceworks.com/t/bulk-cable-run/374855/13","author":{"@type":"Person","name":"will8054","url":"https://community.spiceworks.com/u/will8054"}},{"@type":"Answer","text":"
The problem with suggesting to run a fiber connection as an alternative to a bunch of Cat6 is the additional cost of infrastructure. In order to run a few trunked strands of shielded 10GB 50 micron fiber with SFP connections, he would need to purchase a switch that have dual 10GB fiber ports for each room, 4 GBICs, 2 wicks, 4 patch fibers, and have that all professionally installed by BlackBox or someone else who can guarantee the fiber lights for life. My company did something like this but in reverse when we added on to the building and had to set up a network closet to network the other side. This setup cost us nearly $15,000. That might not be in the budget for this company. If it were that easy for him, I suspect he wouldn’t be seeking advice on how to best run 32 strands of Cat6. BTW, do yourself a favor. Since you’re going to be running the line and have the equipment out already, just fill out a 48 port patch panel to future proof your network for company growth and have backups incase of a problem. 10,000 foot of Cat6 (48*200=9,600) is only about $1,500<\/p>","upvoteCount":1,"datePublished":"2015-01-28T17:12:10.000Z","url":"https://community.spiceworks.com/t/bulk-cable-run/374855/14","author":{"@type":"Person","name":"timothymccall1055","url":"https://community.spiceworks.com/u/timothymccall1055"}},{"@type":"Answer","text":"
I’d also go for the “top of rack” switch idea as well. For 200 ft, you don’t really need fiber, run four or six CAT6A copper cables, set up link aggregation and off you go. The CAT6A gets you going on 1 gig links and can grow to 10 gig.<\/p>\n
A side effect of the top of rack switch is that it keeps the cabling neater (or at least hidden better).<\/p>","upvoteCount":0,"datePublished":"2015-01-28T17:37:26.000Z","url":"https://community.spiceworks.com/t/bulk-cable-run/374855/15","author":{"@type":"Person","name":"joematuscak","url":"https://community.spiceworks.com/u/joematuscak"}},{"@type":"Answer","text":"
A 200 ft fiber run with two 10Gig SFPs and 2 Edgeswitch 48 port switches will cost no where near $15k.<\/p>\n
If you’re on a shoe string budget, run 5 Cat5e/Cat6 cables as aggregate for a 5Gig link.<\/p>","upvoteCount":0,"datePublished":"2015-01-28T17:42:11.000Z","url":"https://community.spiceworks.com/t/bulk-cable-run/374855/16","author":{"@type":"Person","name":"marcspehalski7927","url":"https://community.spiceworks.com/u/marcspehalski7927"}},{"@type":"Answer","text":"
Before deciding on copper vs. fiber, I would advise looking at the current bandwidth use going in/out of the servers. The traffic between servers will be handled by a switch in the new room, so that is less of a factor. Yeah, 10GB fiber will be spendy, but 2 runs of 1Gpbs might be plenty. (And it might not - plan for double or triple your current usage.)<\/p>\n
Total guesswork here<\/em> - You likely have a lot of very large medical imaging files on the servers, but you’re probably only accessing them from a few workstations at a time. Even if 100 people are trying to each pull a 100GB image at the same time, (math exaggerated for effect) you are likely bottlenecked by the server HDD speed. As such, I would pull fiber capable of 10Gbps (after looking up the diameters required, which I have not done), then go with 1Gbps GBICs/switches until such time as 10Gbps is actually required for the network.<\/p>","upvoteCount":0,"datePublished":"2015-01-28T17:50:15.000Z","url":"https://community.spiceworks.com/t/bulk-cable-run/374855/17","author":{"@type":"Person","name":"brian117","url":"https://community.spiceworks.com/u/brian117"}},{"@type":"Answer","text":"Platinum tools makes an EZ Crimper and EZ RJ 45 Jacks.<\/p>\n
You PULL the wires through the jack.<\/p>\n
<\/p>","upvoteCount":1,"datePublished":"2015-01-28T19:19:31.000Z","url":"https://community.spiceworks.com/t/bulk-cable-run/374855/18","author":{"@type":"Person","name":"curtisnewman","url":"https://community.spiceworks.com/u/curtisnewman"}},{"@type":"Answer","text":"
Locate a switch in close proximity to the users and connect it by multimode fiber to your core switch. Don’t waste money on CAT6. CAT5e will cost half as much and work every bit as well.<\/p>","upvoteCount":0,"datePublished":"2015-01-28T23:43:33.000Z","url":"https://community.spiceworks.com/t/bulk-cable-run/374855/19","author":{"@type":"Person","name":"blairgroves","url":"https://community.spiceworks.com/u/blairgroves"}},{"@type":"Answer","text":"
When penetrating a firewall you need to use something like an ez-path<\/a> to provide fire-stopping and maintain the integrity of the firewall. There might be other companies that make a similar product but we have used these and they are super easy to install.<\/p>\nLike others have said do it in multiple pulls through the overhead. I would suggest 8 boxes that gives you 25 feet of extra on each end when you pull into the rooms. Leviton and Amp both make a patch panel that hold jacks and both have tools to make jack termination quick and easy.<\/p>","upvoteCount":0,"datePublished":"2015-01-29T13:53:28.000Z","url":"https://community.spiceworks.com/t/bulk-cable-run/374855/20","author":{"@type":"Person","name":"nathanhornor","url":"https://community.spiceworks.com/u/nathanhornor"}}]}}
samclark2
(Sam2910)
January 28, 2015, 3:00pm
1
I have an upcoming project that I want to bounce off fellow SpiceHeads on how you would approach it.
Project: Relocate servers to another room in the building.
Specific Question: How best to run 32 CAT6 wires from point A (our “Network Room”–location of switches and incoming internet connections) to point B (our new “Server Room”).
-There are 6 firewalls to pass the cabling through.
-Run length is 200 feet
-One-story, currently operating medical facility
-Drop ceiling tiles with 3’ headroom above until you reach the “top”
-No wiring in place that runs the route, no ladder racks or cable supports in place for the route
Pull wires 1-by-1 vs. Bundle them on floor, then hoist up into ceiling as a spine
6 Spice ups
Have a cable company come do it for you. In addition to them having multiple spools of cable that they can pull simultaneously, they will make sure all codes are followed with respect to hanging and putting in appropriate fire stops where they penetrate the firewalls. It’s really not worth the hassle of doing this yourself.
11 Spice ups
rojoloco
(RojoLoco)
January 28, 2015, 3:04pm
3
Hire cable pullers. I do small runs around here, but only above the drop ceiling, and far less than 200ft. In the walls gets subbed out to a pro.
3 Spice ups
Just put a switch(s) in the “Server room” and trunk it back to the “network room” main switch(s) with less cables.
5 Spice ups
Definitely run them together as a fascist. Make a few runs with that large of a number though. Maybe 4 runs of 8 cables. The increase in numbers will give them added durability for the pull without damaging the twisted pairs. Do yourself a favor and label them before bundling them.
Anyway to reduce the number of servers using virtualization?
In our environment a lot of our server traffic is actually between servers not to end users so having a switch in the server room isn’t a bad idea, maybe look at running a 2-4 cable trunk or pulling preterminated fiber?
+1 for switch(es) in the server room.
Get a cabling company in to run a set of fibres between the rooms and use those as the links (add some spare capacity too)
1 Spice up
+1 again for putting a 48 port switch in the existing server room, and running a fiber to the new location. I would probably use Ubiquiti’s edge switches with a 10Gig SFP.
noaccount
(NoAccount)
January 28, 2015, 4:04pm
9
I went through this, in a hospital no less. We ran two separate fiber runs on two separate routes, and placed a couple of switches (stacked ciscos) in the new server room. Less cabling, fewer points of failure, greater redundancy
2 Spice ups
As other have suggested, I would absolutely contract this out. I do 1 - 10 short ethernet runs and never over 30 ft and definitely never through walls unless it’s just drywall. I also never term to RJ-45, it’s just begging for problems. I terminate to a keystone module and put it in a wallplate or “biscuit” (surface box).
However, IF you do decide to do this yourself, no question, pull all the cable on the floor to length, cut each one AND NUMBER THEM on the ends with a labeler or sharpie, then bundle them with zip ties. Running them one by one would be a nightmare and tons of extra headache for no reason. You need to number each cable if one fails after you terminate the ends and test them, you can find which one to troubleshoot. Also, I hope you’re going into a patch panel because you absolutely should be.
1 Spice up
samclark2
(Sam2910)
January 28, 2015, 4:56pm
11
Thank you all for the diverse suggestions and answers. Special thanks goes out to the fiber suggestions (investigating this seriously now) and specifically to CrimsonKidA as he/she directly answered my initial question.
This will be the second time I have handled a server relocation for the company, so I am not new to the process. I contract-out the testing/certification process, but otherwise do everything else in-house. We are a SMB company and that is how things are. My first relocation was performed by running all wires on the ground, labeling them, bundling them, then hoisting the mass into place. I wanted to see if there were any other suggestions as this upcoming relocation extends the run length by an additional 75 feet.
What I learned having pulled 52 Drops just under 7,000 ft of Cat 5 for the first time 2 weeks ago for a doctors office.
As others have mentioned Hire a cable contractor if your able to (My boss swears were not
doing that again). If you do decide to tackle the job remember there is a
building code you need to follow when running cabling through a Firewall/Fire
Stop (the specific code for your State may vary) "Any time you penetrate a
firewall, the code will require you to use the appropriate material to firestop
it back to its original protection rating". Use J hooks to support the
cable every 5 feet, Run under not over air ducting, do not secure with zip ties
to any electrical conduit. Pull multiple cables at the same time: Use
poly line to pull the cables, Use electrical tape to keep lines together when
pulling (zip ties can get hung up on J-hooks), Mark each box of cable 1-5 etc.
then Mark each cable in your bundle with the box number/and pull number IE:
First pull box 1 would be 1-1 second pull box 3 would be 2-3 etc. When you’re
done with each pull mark each cable before cutting and make sure to pull extra
from the box so lines are not short. Each pull you should include a new poly
line with the cabling for the next run See this guide to keep the poly line from twisting around
cables. If you’re running cables through the air plenum (common space above
drop ceilings used for air circulation throughout the hospital) the cable must
be plenum rated.
Credit to cablinginstall.com for firewall information.
4 Spice ups
will8054
(Will8054)
January 28, 2015, 5:08pm
13
You might want to be concerned with fire codes, you did mention that. Any time you go though firewall you have to seal it off properly. This might be reason enough to hire a pro. If there was ever a fire and an investigator found that the fire went though an improper fire stop.
Do you own or lease the building? If you lease then you must make sure everything is done to code, or it could come back on you. Even if you own the building you still have to support the cables in the plenum some how. J hook or other wise.
The problem with suggesting to run a fiber connection as an alternative to a bunch of Cat6 is the additional cost of infrastructure. In order to run a few trunked strands of shielded 10GB 50 micron fiber with SFP connections, he would need to purchase a switch that have dual 10GB fiber ports for each room, 4 GBICs, 2 wicks, 4 patch fibers, and have that all professionally installed by BlackBox or someone else who can guarantee the fiber lights for life. My company did something like this but in reverse when we added on to the building and had to set up a network closet to network the other side. This setup cost us nearly $15,000. That might not be in the budget for this company. If it were that easy for him, I suspect he wouldn’t be seeking advice on how to best run 32 strands of Cat6. BTW, do yourself a favor. Since you’re going to be running the line and have the equipment out already, just fill out a 48 port patch panel to future proof your network for company growth and have backups incase of a problem. 10,000 foot of Cat6 (48*200=9,600) is only about $1,500
1 Spice up
I’d also go for the “top of rack” switch idea as well. For 200 ft, you don’t really need fiber, run four or six CAT6A copper cables, set up link aggregation and off you go. The CAT6A gets you going on 1 gig links and can grow to 10 gig.
A side effect of the top of rack switch is that it keeps the cabling neater (or at least hidden better).
A 200 ft fiber run with two 10Gig SFPs and 2 Edgeswitch 48 port switches will cost no where near $15k.
If you’re on a shoe string budget, run 5 Cat5e/Cat6 cables as aggregate for a 5Gig link.
brian117
(Brian683)
January 28, 2015, 5:50pm
17
Before deciding on copper vs. fiber, I would advise looking at the current bandwidth use going in/out of the servers. The traffic between servers will be handled by a switch in the new room, so that is less of a factor. Yeah, 10GB fiber will be spendy, but 2 runs of 1Gpbs might be plenty. (And it might not - plan for double or triple your current usage.)
Total guesswork here - You likely have a lot of very large medical imaging files on the servers, but you’re probably only accessing them from a few workstations at a time. Even if 100 people are trying to each pull a 100GB image at the same time, (math exaggerated for effect) you are likely bottlenecked by the server HDD speed. As such, I would pull fiber capable of 10Gbps (after looking up the diameters required, which I have not done), then go with 1Gbps GBICs/switches until such time as 10Gbps is actually required for the network.
Platinum tools makes an EZ Crimper and EZ RJ 45 Jacks.
You PULL the wires through the jack.
1 Spice up
blairgroves
(Blair Groves)
January 28, 2015, 11:43pm
19
Locate a switch in close proximity to the users and connect it by multimode fiber to your core switch. Don’t waste money on CAT6. CAT5e will cost half as much and work every bit as well.
When penetrating a firewall you need to use something like an ez-path to provide fire-stopping and maintain the integrity of the firewall. There might be other companies that make a similar product but we have used these and they are super easy to install.
Like others have said do it in multiple pulls through the overhead. I would suggest 8 boxes that gives you 25 feet of extra on each end when you pull into the rooms. Leviton and Amp both make a patch panel that hold jacks and both have tools to make jack termination quick and easy.